Snippets to Ponder, part 2 (#9-13)
#13 This is not a snippet from anything but just a thought I want to add, now that you see what Calvinism teaches. Calvinist pastors preach often about how depraved and wretched and sinful we are, about how we should fall on our knees in gratitude that God chose to save anyone at all when we are all so terrible, and how we should be okay with God's right to predestine people to hell because (according to them) God gets glory for it and because they deserve it even though God predestined it. Blah, blah, blah.
But do you know what we don't hear much about from Calvinists: God's love (unless it's for "the elect"). The two greatest commandments: Love God and love others.
Calvinists are so overly-focused on their doctrines of total depravity and election/predestination and God's "sovereign control of sin" and on their idea that God gets glory for ordaining sin and predestining people to hell that the two greatest commandments are virtually ignored or overshadowed.
Maybe this should alarm us and make us wonder who's really behind Calvinism?
#12 Spiritual PTSD (snippet from "9 Marks of a Calvinist Cult: Conclusion"):
Here are some stories I found online of the real-life damage that Calvinism has done to people (quoted in my post "Calvinism's Heart-Breaking Destruction"):
From a Reddit post called "Calvinism is disgusting":
"As an ex-Christian who used to be a Calvinist, what alarmed me is that all the fears about satan applied to god... [Calvinists] ascribed so many characteristics to god that could be applied to satan that made them seem indistinguishable." (from 'deleted')
"I remember as I was leaving my faith, I thought 'If God exists, then he let my parents waste thousands on private Christian education, let me be baptized and study his word and be confirmed, let me have periods of doubt and repentance, all when he knew that I would be damned to hell.' Even when I was still a Christian, he knew that I was damned and he never helped me." (Uriah_Blacke) [When you're taught that everything is predetermined by God, that Satan is really just God in disguise, and that you don't really have any control over your choices - not even the choice about whether or not you leave the faith - this is where you end up.]
"My parents used to say 'even the cutest baby is a dirty rotten sinner.' It was somewhat of a joke in our family, but also definitely what we all believed. I’m turning 30 this year and I still have trouble turning down the volume on this narrative about myself. It has led to issues in my friendships, with my partner, and now, with my parents... I have deconstructed to the [point] of agnosticism... This has crippled my emotional growth as an adult in ways..." (foreverlanding)
"The [Calvinist] concept of total depravity is so completely toxic. I'm still unlearning this as well. It does make me angry sometimes thinking about how absolutely f*cked up it is to teach children they are inherently awful just for being... The system is designed to make you feel like a POS [piece of sh*t] just for being a human. I'm 37 now and am agnostic after trying really hard to believe until about 2ish years ago. I feel more hopeful and free without the church." (eab1728)
"Agreed. Total Depravity isn't the "Good News" espoused in Reformed circles... Reformed doctrine never allowed me to truly accept my own self-worth; it robbed me of dignity and replaced it with constant, grating guilt. And it's utterly worthless in the face of real hardship... I am a universalist now, which couldn't be further from Reformed doctrine. And honestly, what a relief." (come_heroine)
"This is a screenshot from an email that I sent to my mom when I was 12 years old, simply titled "distressed". [In the email, the 12-year-old is telling the parent that she (I'll just assume it's a 'she' for now) is distressed because she's praying and reading the Bible, but nothing is happening. She's looking for assurance that she's saved, one of the elect. And the father replies that she should keep asking God to show her the way, that only God can save her, that only God can awaken her dead spirit and make her alive, that she can't do anything to save herself. So essentially, it's "Do something about it, but you can't do anything about it, and so wait to see if God convinces you that you're one of the elect." So confusing. So biblically off-track. And it basically just boils down to "if you're not elect, you can't do anything about it and there's no hope for you." No wonder the kid is distressed!] I'm so angry that I was taught that I was completely bad, simply by being human, and I deserved to be tortured by the Creator for all of eternity, AND I COULD DO NOTHING ABOUT IT. All I could do was pray to God and hope that he had mercy on such a miserable, worthless, depraved wretch such as twelve-year-old me. I lived with a phobia of hell until the cage of my mind opened when I was 22, and I could finally think for the first time in my life..." (why-homo-sapien)
"A few years ago I was wondering why my self-esteem was so crap and then suddenly realised that the people who taught me to hate myself were my parents, through the medium of calvinism :)" (pktechboi)
From the Reddit post (with a few minor spelling and punctuation corrections) called: I have posted on another Group as well. I NEED SOMEONE TO EXPLAIN Calvinism to me because what I understand of it is scaring me!!! : r/Christians (reddit.com): "Okay.... so I have just watched a sermon from Paul Washer (which I thought was one of the most amazing sermons I have ever seen). That man has a fire for Christ that cannot be extinguished. But for the first time, I found out what Calvinism is. And I am scared to death!!! So if I am not elected by God to be saved, I will not be saved??? No matter how much time I devoted to prayer, how many times I have been broken by his feet have, how many hours I spent learning scripture, how many days I "thought" I was talking to my best friend. It was all just a lie??? I come in heaven just to realize I was never elected??? And get thrown into hell because the day I was born I was already doomed from the beginning??? And my whole faith is just one big hoax???" (Dingus_bellator1027) (That's some serious struggling going on right there! And Calvinism can offer no real hope, no real help, no real comfort other than "wait until you die to see if you won the salvation lottery or not".)
From the Reddit post "Verily verily I say unto thee, f*ck this sh*t!" which starts with this quote from Kevin DeYoung (which can also be found in his article on limited atonement): "Jesus did not die for every sinner, but for His own people. The Good Shepherd gives His life not for the goats, but for the sheep":
"This was a huge factor in my own deconversion. Even if this was an actual literal proven fact, there's no way I could love and worship a being who did/does this." (from justalapforcats)
"Welp, that takes a lot of pressure off of me as an atheist. I won't worry about whatever Jesus did, because he didn't die for me anyways." (from chucklesthegrumpy)
Miss_an100 responds to that with "...When I realized our own judicial system treats us better than this sadistic god, I was out. 30 years of my life. Sure, there were good memories. But the weight of it all sure took a toll on me eventually. Thankful I can breath a bit more easy now not worrying if I have committed the unpardonable sin. I’m certain I have 100x over. ;) ..."
If you are raising kids in a Calvinist church, take all of this very seriously. Because this could be them someday: "I have recently discovered the doctrine of election and I believe that I am not elect. I don't have any spiritual fruit and I hate God with all my heart. My question is, at this point is it right to want to die? Might as well go to hell now instead of later. I do not want to kill myself (I never will hopefully) but I cant see a reason to live when my end destiny will be the same." (from "deleted") (Found in Election and Suicide : r/Calvinism (reddit.com))
(And I can only hope that the last one is a sick joke.)
John Piper, in answer to the question “Does God Predestine People to Hell?”, says “My answer is yes. God does determine from eternity who will be saved."
John MacArthur: “God's love for the elect is an infinite, eternal, saving love... Such love clearly is not directed toward all of mankind indiscriminately, but is bestowed uniquely and individually on those whom God chose in eternity past.”
Wayne Grudem: “If God ultimately decided to create some creatures to be saved and others not to be saved, then that was his sovereign choice, and we have no moral or scriptural basis on which we can insist that it was not fair... Reformed theologians say that God deems his own glory more important than saving everyone, and that God’s glory is also furthered by the fact that some are not saved.”
R.C. Sproul Jr.: “God wills all things that come to pass… God desired for man to fall into sin... God is as delighted with His wrath as He is with all of His attributes."
John Piper: “Has God predetermined every tiny detail in the universe... and all of our besetting sins?... Yes, every horrible thing and every sinful thing is ultimately governed by God… He controls everything, and he does it for his glory and our good.”
Gordan H. Clark: “... if a man gets drunk and shoots his family, it was the will of God... this view certainly makes God the cause of sin."
Theodore Zachariades: "God works all things after the counsel of His will, even keeping those kings who want to commit adultery from committing so... and when He wants to, He orders those to commit adultery when HE WANTS TO!"
James White, in answer to the question: “When a child is raped, is God responsible and did He decree that rape?”, says "... Yes, [He decreed it] because if not, then it's meaningless and purposeless..."
Mark Talbot/John Piper: “God brings about all things in accordance with his will. It isn’t just that God manages to turn the evil aspects of our world to good for those that love him; it is rather that he himself brings about these evil aspects… This includes God’s having even brought about the Nazi’s brutality at Birkenau and Auschwitz as well as … the sexual abuse of a young child.”
Paul Washer: “If you reject Christ, then the moment when you take your first step through the gates of hell, the only thing you will hear is all of creation standing to its feet and applauding and praising God because God has rid the earth of you. That’s how not good you are."
Kevin DeYoung: "Should Christians rejoice in the doctrine of hell?... in one sense it is appropriate for Christians to say 'I don’t like the idea of hell.' But be careful. It’s never safe to dislike the truths God has revealed. We should actually like what the Bible teaches."
R.C. Sproul: "Don't you know that when you're in heaven, you'll be so sanctified that you'll be able to see your own mother in hell and rejoice in that, knowing that God's perfect justice is being carried out."
Vincent Cheung: “All that God does is intrinsically good and righteous, so it is also good and righteous for him to create the reprobates."
Vincent Cheung: "…man is morally responsible even if he lacks moral ability; that is, man must obey God even if he cannot obey God... man must obey God's commands because God says that man must obey, and whether or not he has the ability to obey is irrelevant."
Vincent Cheung: "God decreed evil ultimately for his own glory... One who thinks that God's glory is not worth the death and suffering of billions of people has too high an opinion of himself and humanity [and] should reconsider their spiritual commitment, to see if they are truly in the faith.”
Vincent Cheung: “The popular position that all infants are saved is wishful thinking, and continues as a groundless religious tradition... Thus [it] deceives the masses and offers them hope based on mere fantasy... if the parents cannot finally accept [the idea of infant damnation], that God is always right, then they are headed for hell themselves and need to become Christians… If someone dies without hearing the gospel, it just means that God has decreed his damnation beforehand... This would mean that those who are unable to exercise faith are all damned to hell, and this would include infants and the mentally retarded... I have no misgivings about this. I have no problem with the idea that all who die as embryos, infants, and mentally retarded would burn in hell... if they all burn in hell, they all burn in hell…”
Calvinism makes me sick.
And I think it's majorly responsible for much of the atheism out there today. Because if this is how God really is (He's not!) - and if people are tricked into thinking that Calvinism and Christianity are one and the same - then it's no wonder people reject God and the gospel. A God like that cannot be trusted and is really no better than Satan.
[For more quotes (and the resources where the quotes are from) and for my responses to the quotes, see "A Crash Course in Calvinism (Calvinist quotes)."]
#11 (I moved this over from "quick answers to Calvinism.")
When non-Calvinists ask Calvinists how they could think it's okay for God to "ordain" (preplan/orchestrate/direct/cause) all sin, evil, and unbelief but to then punish us for it, for what He predestined and we had no control over or ability to resist - when we ask how God can do those things and yet still be considered "good" and "just" - Calvinists say things like "Well, what's sin, evil, and injustice to us is not necessarily sin, evil, and injustice to God, because He sees and judges things differently than we do."
One Calvinist I quoted (in this post) said this (paraphrased): "Sin is when we break God's laws. But since He didn't give Himself these laws - since He didn't tell Himself that He can't do those things - then it's not sin for Him to do them." And in response to someone who said that God wouldn't be a just God if He sent people to hell without giving them a choice or a chance to be redeemed, he said (paraphrased), "God gets to decide what's just and what's not. So even if something seems unjust to us, it doesn't mean it is unjust. Because it might be just in God's judgment."
John Calvin teaches this too (from Concerning the Eternal Predestination of God): "But the objection is not yet resolved, that if all things are done by the will of God, and men contrive nothing except by His will and ordination, then God is the author of all evils... [however] God may be free of guilt in doing the very thing that He condemns in Satan and the reprobate and which is to be condemned by men... Hence, since the criminal misdeeds by men proceed from God with a cause that is just, though perhaps unknown to us, though the first cause of all things is His will, I nevertheless deny that He is the author of sin. [Deny it all you want, Johnny, but it's what your theology undeniable teaches, no matter how you try to spin or soften it.] ... What I have maintained about the diversity of causes must not be forgotten: the proximate cause is one thing, the remote cause another... For what man wickedly perpetrates, incited by ambition or avarice or lust or some other depraved motive, since God does it by His hand with a righteous though perhaps hidden purpose - this cannot be equated with the term sin. Sin in man is made by perfidy, cruelty, pride, intemperance, envy, blind love of self, any kind of depraved lust. Nothing like this is to be found in God."
All Calvin is saying here is that what's sin for man and Satan is not sin for God because He doesn't have our sin nature. So Calvi-god can do any kind of and amount of evil he wants - the same kinds and amounts we do, that Satan does - but it can never be considered evil for him (only for us and Satan) because he doesn't have our sin nature. Calvi-god's actions - even ones that would be considered evil if done by us or Satan - flow from his (supposedly) good character and pure motives, not bad ones like we and Satan have. Therefore, whatever Calvi-god does is good, even if it's the same evil things we and Satan do. ("Good" loses all meaning when it's used to excuse evil, when the line between good and evil is erased.)
And John MacArthur would agree (Doctrine of Election, part 1): "... The pervasive notion of these skeptics and critics of this doctrine is that somehow election is unfair. Somehow it is unjust. But first of all, we want to make it very clear that God is not to be measured by our understanding of what is just... God has ways and thoughts that are to us incomprehensible, unresolvable, inscrutable... It is an essential understanding of God that he is holy, that his nature is holy, that he is infinitely and perfectly just, that he is morally flawless and perfect, that he is perfection. Everything in him and of him and for him and from him and by him is perfect. And so whatever he says is just is what justice is. [But the problem isn't what God says is just, but it's what Calvinists say is just. And that's very different!]... And whatever it is that he wills is by definition just because he is just. [Which is how Calvinists can excuse any evil thing Calvi-god does.] It is just because he wills it. It is not because he sees that it is just that he wills it, it is that he wills it and then it becomes just. [And so, therefore, it's just for Calvi-god to will anything he wants to, even murder and abuse and unbelief. It's not that he does what's just, but it's that whatever he does is just, just because he does it.]
... The Creator owes nothing to the creature who cannot understand his ways, cannot understand his mind, cannot be his counselor.... Salvation never has been a matter of fairness. And yet that’s what people say. 'That’s not fair. That’s not fair.'... And this is the bone that people always choke on in the doctrine of election. And Paul anticipated it [and] gives an amazing response, 'Who are you, O man, who answers back to God?' Shut your mouth. That doesn’t clarify anything. Who do you think you are? Are you accusing God of unjust punishment of sinners? Are you accusing God of unjust condemnation? Are you accusing God of evil? You better close your mouth before you say anything else.... Don’t you dare question God. God’s the potter, you’re the clay. The clay is so far beneath the potter. It is inanimate dirt. It has no right to even entertain the idea of speaking to the potter... So what if God wants to demonstrate his wrath? Doesn’t he have a right to demonstrate his wrath? Isn’t that part of his glory? Can’t he put his wrath on display? He is God. Can’t God make his power known in his judgment, in his wrath, in his condemnation? Yes he can.... God has every right to demonstrate his wrath [through reprobating the non-elect to hell], and he is as much glorified in his wrath as he is in his mercy."
[Basically, this is just "Shut up, you tiny human, and accept what we Calvinists teach you, without question or pushback!"]
Calvinism erases the line between good and evil, between justice and injustice. It tries to convince us that they can be one and the same, that there might not really be a difference between the two. (Can you not see how satanic this is!?!)
But if evil and good, justice and injustice, are essentially the same to God - if we can't really know the difference because there might not really be one in God's eyes - then how in the world can we obey all the verses that tell us to do good and seek/apply justice!?!
Isaiah 1:16-17: "... Stop doing wrong, learn to do right! Seek justice ..."
Micah 6:8: "He has showed you, O man, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly ..."
Psalm 106:3: "Blessed are they who maintain justice, who constantly do what is right."
Jer. 22:3: "This is what the Lord says: Do what is just and right..."
Prov. 31:9: "Speak up and judge fairly..."
Psalm 37:27: "Turn from evil and do good..."
Amos 5:15: "Hate evil, love good; maintain justice in the courts..."
Zec. 7:9: "This is what the Lord Almighty says: 'Administer true justice...'"
And these are just a few. All of these verses mean nothing if we are to believe that we can't know what real good or real justice is, that there's ultimately no real dividing line between evil and good, between injustice and justice, at least as far as we can tell.
Lev. 19:15: "Do not pervert justice..."
But this is exactly what Calvinism does!
Isaiah 5:20: "Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter."
But this is exactly what Calvinism does! [And what nonsense that verse is if, as Calvinists say, we can't even really know the difference between good and evil because there might not really be one.]
But do you know what's really funny about all this?
Proverbs 28:5 tells us "Evil men do not understand justice, but those who seek the Lord understand it fully."
Proverbs 2:6,9 says "For the Lord gives wisdom, and from his mouth come knowledge and understanding... Then you will understand what is right and just and fair - every good path."
And Hebrews 5:14 tells us "But solid food is for the mature, who by constant use have trained themselves to distinguish good from evil."
And so if Calvinists say we can't really tell the difference between good and evil, between justice and injustice, because there may not ultimately be one, then what does this tell us about Calvinists!?!
C.S. Lewis, in The Problem of Pain chapter 2, says that "if God's moral judgment differs from ours so that our 'black' may be His 'white,' we can mean nothing by calling Him good; for to say 'God is good,' while asserting that His goodness is wholly other than ours, is really only to say 'God is we know not what'. And an utterly unknown quality in God cannot give us moral grounds for loving or obeying Him. If He is not (in our sense) 'good' we shall obey, if at all, only through fear - and should be equally ready to obey an omnipotent Fiend. The doctrine of Total Depravity - when the consequence is drawn that, since we are totally depraved, our idea of good is simply nothing - may thus turn Christianity into a form of devil-worship."
Amen and amen!
If we cannot distinguish between true good and true evil, between true justice and true injustice, then we cannot call God good and just - because those words are meaningless, meaning the same as their opposites. Calvinism erases the line between good and evil, which essentially erases the line between God and Satan. It lowers God to Satan's level... which, consequently, elevates Satan to God's level.
And who do you think benefits from this?
#10 1 John 2:22: “Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ.”
If God preplans and causes the "non-elect" to deny that Jesus is the Christ, doesn't that make God complicit in the lie, turning Him into a liar who's spreading lies?
#9 It's interesting to see the warped perspective Calvinists have of their Calvinist god vs. the non-Calvinist God (from my post "Non-Calvinism is DISGUSTING and IMMORAL"):
In the comment section of a Soteriology 101 post, a non-Calvinist made this comment: “They [non-Calvinists] believe God loves all of mankind, died for all, wants all to repent and none to perish (like the Bible clearly says). God’s greatest act of love is available as a free gift to all who will receive it.”).
And Roland (a Calvinist) replied with this:
Imagine you're a parent watching your children play on a driveway. You're sitting in the garage with the garage door open. Your children are playing in the driveway. They all begin to run towards the street. You begin to shout out to them. “Turn around! There is danger in the street. If you run into the street, you will be struck by a car and killed!”
As the parent, you have the power to stop them. But you don’t because you believe that if you save them, their love for you is not genuine. Their turning back from the danger must be done freely, without coercion. Yet you are shouting, “I love you. Turn back from the danger.” You know that if they run into the street your children will be struck by a car and killed. You have the power to stop them. You have the knowledge that they will be struck by a car and killed. Yet your only actions are pleading, begging, and shouting to them to turn back. And when they don’t, when you fail to take action to stop them, they perish.
This is why I find non-calvinism DISGUSTING and IMMORAL. At least in Calvinism God does take action and save His elect. In non-calvinism, God does not take action. He saves none. He CAN only wait for His “free creatures” to make a “freewill” decision to turn to Him and live. Which none of His “free creatures” do unless God intervenes.
The Calvinist does not have this problem. The PASSIVE and OBSERVANT God [my note: he's saying this is the non-Calvinist God] does nothing but invite. The God of the Bible [my note: he's saying this is the Calvinist god] does much more than invite. He actually saves. In non-calvinism, God does not save but only offers to save. In Calvinism, God SAVES! In non-calvinism, God watches sinners die, knows they’re going to die, has the power to save them from eternal punishment yet does nothing but invite or offer to save.
Cap locks for emphasis, not yelling.
I replied to Roland with this (and for the record, I really like and respect Roland and have told him so several times):
Roland said: “Imagine you're a parent watching your children play on a driveway…. They all begin to run towards the street… You know that if they run into the street your children will be struck by a car and killed. You have the power to stop them. You have the knowledge that they will be struck by a car and killed. Yet your only actions are pleading, begging, and shouting to them to turn back. And when they don’t, when you fail to take action to stop them, they perish. This is why I find non-calvinism DISGUSTING and IMMORAL. At least in Calvinism God does take action and save His elect.”
So you’d rather have a God who caused most of his children to irresistibly desire to run into traffic and be killed, giving them no ability/chance to do otherwise … a God who created them specifically for that end because He takes pleasure in it and is glorified by it and because it shows the “elect” ones how much more loved they are by comparison … a God who only pretends to care about the non-elect children, who “warns” them about the dangers of running into traffic and commands them to not run into traffic but who ultimately programmed them to run into traffic, and then He blames them for not listening to His warnings, punishing them for it eternally, even though they couldn’t choose anything else?
But hey, never mind about the damned ones, right? At least a few of us were chosen to be saved. A few of us were given by Calvi-god the ability/desire to obey him when he said to not run into traffic. Isn’t Calvi-god good, gracious, loving, and just! (Just don’t think about those predestined to hell!) Who are we to understand him anyway or to talk back to him?
(The sarcasm is to emphasize my disgust with Calvinism, not to be hard on you, Roland.)
Roland said: “In non-calvinism, God does not take action. He saves none. He CAN only wait for His 'free creatures' to make a 'freewill' decision to turn to Him and live…. In non-calvinism, God does not save but only offers to save.”
Actually, in non-calvinism, God did indeed take action and do something to save people, something much more than just begging and pleading: He died on the cross in our place to save us all from hell. And then He spent years getting the gospel written down to spread the message of salvation. And He put evidence of Himself in nature and in our hearts to call us all to Him. He reaches out to all people to tell them that He loves them and that they can be saved. He did everything, except make our decision for us.
To go back to your illustration, Roland (and remember all illustrations fall short at some point): Biblically, God doesn’t just sit and watch His kids run into the street, merely pleading that they stop. No! He has consistently and repeatedly told us all about the dangers of running into the road (through prophets and Scripture), commands us to not run into the road, has made a way to safety and shown us the way to safety, has put up warning signs and roadblocks, etc. And then even when we keep running to the road, by our own choice, He tries to pull us back over and over again. (But He has given us the right to make the decision to listen to Him or not.) And on top of all that, God also threw Himself in front of the cars to get hit Himself, to take the “punishment” so that no one else had to get hit (eternally). No one has to run into the road and get killed. And yet in spite of all that, many of us choose to ignore Him and His warnings, to reject His sacrifice, and we willingly plunge headlong into traffic ourselves. Because we don’t want God telling us what to do.
And yet you, Roland, would blame God for that, for us not listening, accusing Him of not doing enough to save us?
Roland said: “In Calvinism, God SAVES!.”
Yes, a few people. While destroying so many more.
Roland said: “In non-calvinism, God watches sinners die, knows they’re going to die, has the power to save them from eternal punishment yet does nothing but invite or offer to save.”
And yet you have no problem with the fact that, in Calvinism, God doesn’t just watch sinners die but He causes/creates most sinners to die, predestining them to hell – even though He has the power to predestine no one to hell – giving them no chance/ability to be saved because Calvi-Jesus never died for them anyway.
At least the non-Calvinist Jesus died to make salvation available to all and the non-Calvinist God truly offers real salvation to all. (And like I said, the non-Calvinist God does much more than just invite or offer.)
Roland, try thinking a little less about how “good” the Calvinist god is to save just a few people, and think a little more about how wretched he is to create most people to burn for eternity in hell (when he has the ability to predestine no one to hell), how disgusting it is that he is glorified by that and ultimately takes pleasure in it, how wrong he is to tell people to repent and believe while preventing them from repenting and believing, how unjust he is to command people to not sin but then he causes them to sin and punishes them for it, etc.
If you are this backwards/warped/deluded in your ideas of what the non-Calvinist God is like and what the Calvinist God is like then I’m worried for you, Roland. I really am. I suggest that you pray and ask God to take off any blinders Satan may have put on you. Tell God you want to know the truth, even if it means realizing/admitting you were wrong all along. (Are you willing to do this? If not – if you’re so worried about finding out you might be wrong that you can’t pray this – then that is telling.)
... Think about it. REALLY think about it. God’s name and character and the gospel and people’s souls and the condition of your eternity are at stake here.
